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Mar 25th 2009

Bush Deficits and Obama Deficits

bush-deficit-vs-obama-deficit

Good news: Obama will cut the deficit in half in four years…that is, after he quintuples it first.

20 Responses to “Bush Deficits and Obama Deficits”

  1. I know that there is a lot of disgust on the right for the media’s “love” of Obama, but the press conference last night showed me that the honeymoon is over. It had been brewing though as Obama revealed more and more of his agenda and budget proposals.

    I think that most people disliked how Bush spent so much and now to have a democrat, or anyone, in the White House proposing these kinds of numbers…they won’t have it.

    Congressional democrats are starting to speak out. The media is speaking out. They’re seeing what happens when you let an untested community organizer become the President of the United States.

    Buyer’s remorse sucks when you can’t exchange for 4 years.

  2. N Chung

    Oh brother. First of all Obama’s approval ratings are still high at 61%. But on to substantive matters, this is misleading. The high deficits for 2009 and 2010 are obviously due to the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression that precipitated a huge bailout and stimulus.

    When the stimulus expires the deficit as a % of GDP will fall to around 3%, the same as it was during the Bush years.

  3. Miguelisimo

    Yeah Travis,

    the deficit will be about the same as it was under Bush (eventually)–that’s what we’ve been trying to tell you: we hated Bush’s policies (and him personally), but when someone else has different policies that produce (supposedly) the exact same result, then THOSE policies are good. And then we like that guy better than Bush. DUH!

    Why is that so hard for you to understand? It’s not that complicated.

    Thanks for keepin’ it real N Chung.

  4. When the stimulus expires the deficit as a % of GDP will fall to around 3%, the same as it was during the Bush years.

    I think that this statement about the deficit being 3% is still a losing argument. Not only do Obama White House estimates never fall below deficit spending during Bush White House years (Let alone CBO estimates), but it is advocating massive deficit spending. Massive deficit spending! The country just elected Obama to avoid 4 or 8 more years of “the same.”

    Deficit spending should not be a normal thing. Obama himself championed a “pay as you go” policy.

    I think that democrats are starting to turn against this massive spending hike over the next several years and the media is also shocked at the about face on campaign commitments to be more responsible.

    I, like others, think it is hard to argue that investing (through deficit spending) in education, alternative energy and health care reform is going to be a good thing.

  5. Oh brother. First of all Obama’s approval ratings are still high at 61%.

    I was talking about congressional democrats and the media, instead of the general public support for him.

    With regard to “buyer’s remorse” I think we’re beginning to see the what will be a broad realization among democrats, the media and eventually voters everywhere that Obama is breaking his promises on many, many things.

    Like I said in an earlier comment, the honeymoon is over.

  6. doug

    First of all Obama’s approval ratings are still high at 61%.

    Unfortunately for Obama he is quickly reaching the natural floor of his support, in other words, only those who voted for him approve of his performance as President. He hasn’t reached it yet, but he’s falling there quicker than Clinton or Bush II did.

    The high deficits for 2009 and 2010 are obviously due to the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression that precipitated a huge bailout and stimulus.

    Which makes me wonder why he is bragging about cutting it.

    He sounds like a guy bragging to his wife that he will spend half as much next year on fishing gear because he just bought a $50,000 boat. “I promise, honey, only $25K next year!”

    When the stimulus expires the deficit as a % of GDP will fall to around 3%, the same as it was during the Bush years.

    I certainly hope that all these new initiatives and programs expire.

    Anyways…I watched the press conference on Tuesday night. Sadly this has devolved into comedy. Sacrifice? Shared responsibility? Good grief, tons of his nominees didn’t even pay their taxes. And the teleprompter? They ditched the glass screens and stuck a widescreen TV in back so people wouldn’t know he was reading his prepared remarks. Huh?

    Worse still, Obama’s complete BS assertion that cutting the deduction for charitable contributions won’t hurt non-profits. Heh.

  7. Was there seriously a big TV in the back of the room?

    It’s like, can’t we do better America? This is our leader?

  8. N Chung

    Deficit spending should not be a normal thing. Obama himself championed a “pay as you go” policy.

    I don’t recall Obama committing to PAYGO as he promised during the campaign to halve the deficit only. But if you have a link I’d be glad to see it.

    I, like others, think it is hard to argue that investing (through deficit spending) in education, alternative energy and health care reform is going to be a good thing.

    If you do it wrong, then it’s money down the drain. But if you demand more accountability from teachers, then, then those things are necessary. Education, health, and conservation are all externalities in which the private sector underinvests.

    Obama made a great point in the press conference. Finance-led growth will always lead to a bubble. We need real productivity growth if we’re to grow the economy in the long run, hence we need to make these investments.

    I was talking about congressional democrats and the media, instead of the general public support for him.

    Maybe so, but as long as overall

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090325/ap_on_go_co/congress_budget

    it’ll be OK.

  9. N Chung

    Worse still, Obama’s complete BS assertion that cutting the deduction for charitable contributions won’t hurt non-profits.

    While I agree with you, is this the same Doug who believes that charitable giving should be independent of the tax code? I know it’s not the same thing, but still.

  10. I don’t recall Obama committing to PAYGO as he promised during the campaign to halve the deficit only. But if you have a link I’d be glad to see it.

    About 1:06 in this video.

    And then this WhiteHouse.gov page on the Obama administration’s stated fiscal policies.You just can’t make this stuff up…

    If you do it wrong, then it’s money down the drain. But if you demand more accountability from teachers, then, then those things are necessary.

    Please raise your hand if you think that the federal government is going to competently manage a significant and effective restructuring of the educational systems nationwide. Not a whiff of discussion on WhiteHouse.gov about “accountability from teachers.” Instead a lot of talk about hiring more and more teachers. But these ones we’re told, will be better.

    The problem I foresee is money being spent without comparable results. I worry that it would simply be throwing more money at a problem. Obama’s own Secretary of Education has already talked about lengthening the school year. The amount of money and time spent in schools is not what is limiting students’ potential.

    Education, health, and conservation are all externalities in which the private sector underinvests.

    That is a good point, but to devalue our currency to invest further in them? Doesn’t it sort of seem like maxing out all your credit cards to send a child to college, hoping their degree will in time be able to pay back all the debt and accrued interest?

    We are on an economic tightrope. The timing of new massive deficit spending just seems doubly wrong.

  11. doug

    While I agree with you, is this the same Doug who believes that charitable giving should be independent of the tax code? I know it’s not the same thing, but still.

    I don’t see the faintest contradiction to what we were talking about there…but I could be missing something.

    In that comment I said:

    John Edwards’ actions have no effect whatsoever on my personal desire (and obligation!) to help the less fortunate.

    I stand by that. It has become even more clear in the past year what a complete schmuck Edwards is.

    In the current blog post, I say:

    Obama’s complete BS assertion that cutting the deduction for charitable contributions won’t hurt non-profits.

    I think it is pretty obvious to any thinking person that cutting the deduction will lead to less giving.

    As an aside, there are a lot of non-profits that have nothing to do with poverty.

  12. N Chung

    Not a whiff of discussion on WhiteHouse.gov about “accountability from teachers.” Instead a lot of talk about hiring more and more teachers. But these ones we’re told, will be better.

    He made the public announcement here.

    Doesn’t it sort of seem like maxing out all your credit cards to send a child to college, hoping their degree will in time be able to pay back all the debt and accrued interest?

    I don’t know, why don’t you ask Ronald Reagan? But anyway, as long as GDP grows 3% a year like it normally does, and the deficit is under 3% of GDP we’re fine.

    Obama is proposing the deepest cuts in discretionary spending in history. That said, I think he should, a la Bill Clinton, put off the social programs until the bills are paid.

  13. N Chung

    Obama’s complete BS assertion that cutting the deduction for charitable contributions won’t hurt non-profits.

    I think it is pretty obvious to any thinking person that cutting the deduction will lead to less giving.

    Maybe so, but Obama’s counterargument was the hiking the estate tax will increase charitable living.

    Here is a study by Martin Feldstein on the effects on charitable giving of hiking deductions.

    Here is a CBO study on the negative impact on charitable giving of eliminating the estate tax.

    Which one is greater? Don’t know.

  14. travis

    Which one is greater? Don’t know.

    Please admit you are being irresponsible by advocating this change in policy when you have absolutely no idea if it will be beneficial or not.

    Respectfully submitted this 31st of March 2009.

    Travis

  15. He made the public announcement here.

    Thanks for the link to the politico article. It sounds promising. I certainly hope that he cracks down on teacher unions, but as I’ve come to learn quickly from Obama, talk is cheap. My own observation of a lack of detail on WhiteHouse.gov about a plan to get rid of bad teachers and such, is coupled with this statement in the article itself:

    The White House didn’t specify how the president would like to see poor-performing teachers removed from the classroom.

    Perhaps I’m jumping the gun, but if we’re going to be spending billions of new dollars, ought we not to have a comprehensive and transparent plan that explains it? That being the crux of the argument:

    N Chung: But if you demand more accountability from teachers, then, then those things are necessary.

    That is the hinge of your argument to justify deficit spending on education, but it is just a ball of words right now from the President.

    And yet, we’re constantly reminded by him and his secretary of education that we must act.

    I reject a system that rewards failure and protects a person from its consequences. The stakes are too high. We can afford nothing but the best when it comes to our children’s teachers and to the schools where they teach.

    Lets cut the horse crap and hear what is is he plans to do. Perhaps time will prove your point out.

    On an aside, I hope everyone is aghast at how he now want to lengthen the school year.

    We can no longer afford an academic calendar designed when America was a nation of farmers who needed their children at home plowing the land at the end of each day.

    Well, if anyone knows what we need in the educational system, it’s Obama.

  16. N Chung

    Please admit you are being irresponsible by advocating this change in policy when you have absolutely no idea if it will be beneficial or not.

    I did not advocate a change in this policy. In fact, if you read a little more closely, I agreed with Doug on this one.

  17. travis

    AMENDED REQUEST FOR ADMISSIONS

    Please admit Obama is being irresponsible by advocating this change in policy when he has absolutely no idea if it will be beneficial or not.

    thanks in advance!

  18. N Chung

    Please admit Obama is being irresponsible by advocating this change in policy when he has absolutely no idea if it will be beneficial or not.

    No, because that would entail some nebulous definition of “beneficial.” If he claimed the deduction cap would not hurt charitable contributions, and make a big deal about it, then he’d be doing the same thing Goldberg is doing. But he did no such thing.

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